College After High School: Is It Still Worth It?

Attending college after high school represents a significant decision point for many, but its value proposition is increasingly debated in light of rising tuition costs. The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics data indicates that individuals with bachelor’s degrees generally earn more than those with only a high school diploma, highlighting a potential economic advantage. However, the increasing popularity of alternative educational paths, such as programs offered by Coursera, suggests that traditional higher education faces competition from more flexible and specialized options. Debt accumulation, often a consequence of funding a college education, can offset the long-term financial benefits, influencing graduates’ career choices and lifestyles. The perspectives of thought leaders such as Peter Thiel, who have questioned the conventional wisdom surrounding higher education, further fuel the discussion about whether the investment in attending college after high school still yields worthwhile returns.

The Enduring Question of College Value: Navigating a Landscape of Change

Is a college degree still worth it? In the 21st century, this question echoes through households, high school hallways, and the halls of academia itself. The rising cost of tuition, coupled with a rapidly evolving job market, has fueled a persistent debate about the necessity and intrinsic value of higher education.

The Shifting Sands of Higher Education

Once considered the undisputed pathway to upward mobility and professional success, a college degree now faces unprecedented scrutiny. Many question whether the investment in time and money truly yields the promised returns. The narrative is complex, fraught with anxieties about student debt and the perceived skills gap between academic training and employer demands.

A Balanced Perspective: Enduring Value and Evolving Realities

While acknowledging these valid concerns, it’s crucial to avoid a purely reductionist view of higher education. The value of a college degree extends far beyond immediate financial gains. It encompasses personal development, the cultivation of critical thinking skills, and the expansion of intellectual horizons.

These elements remain vital, irrespective of short-term economic fluctuations. A balanced perspective requires recognizing the enduring value of higher education while addressing the pressing challenges of cost and relevance.

For High School Students: Charting a Course

The decision of whether to pursue a college degree is a pivotal one, particularly for high school students. Their aspirations, anxieties, and expectations surrounding college need careful consideration. Guidance and resources are essential to help them navigate the complex landscape of higher education options.

For College Students: Maximizing the Investment

Similarly, current college students need to actively engage with their education. The goal should be to maximize their investment through strategic major selection, internship opportunities, and the development of relevant skills.

Career opportunities, personal development, and long-term earning potential remain central to the equation. The question isn’t simply whether to attend college, but how to make the most of the experience. The college experience should lead to becoming a well-rounded individual and marketable professional.

This exploration is about understanding the real value proposition of higher education in a world that’s constantly in flux.

Diverse Perspectives on Higher Education: A Human-Centered Approach

The discourse surrounding higher education often revolves around statistics, economic projections, and institutional rankings. However, to truly understand the value—and the challenges—of pursuing a college degree, we must turn our attention to the diverse individuals whose lives are directly impacted by the higher education ecosystem. Examining the perspectives of students, graduates, educators, and employers provides a more nuanced and human-centered understanding of this complex issue.

The Aspirations and Anxieties of High School Students

For many high school students, the path to college is perceived as both a golden ticket and a daunting challenge. Aspirations run high, fueled by dreams of career success, personal growth, and expanding intellectual horizons. Yet, these aspirations are often tempered by anxieties surrounding academic performance, financial burdens, and the uncertainty of choosing the "right" path.

The pressure to excel academically and secure admission to a prestigious institution can be immense, leading to increased stress and mental health concerns. Furthermore, the rising cost of tuition and the prospect of accumulating significant student debt can deter even the most motivated students from pursuing their college dreams.

Navigating the Pivotal Decision-Making Process

The college application process itself is a labyrinth of standardized tests, essays, recommendation letters, and financial aid forms. Students grapple with questions about their interests, skills, and career aspirations, often feeling overwhelmed by the sheer number of options available.

Guidance from high school counselors, teachers, and family members plays a crucial role in helping students navigate this pivotal decision-making process, providing support, advice, and resources to make informed choices.

The College Experience: Academic Challenges, Social Life, and Personal Growth

The college years represent a transformative period in the lives of young adults. Students are exposed to new ideas, diverse perspectives, and challenging academic material, pushing them to think critically, solve problems, and develop intellectual curiosity.

Beyond the classroom, college offers a rich social environment where students can forge lifelong friendships, explore their identities, and develop leadership skills. However, the college experience is not without its challenges. Students face academic pressure, financial constraints, and the need to balance their studies with social activities and personal responsibilities.

Balancing Act: School, Social Life and Mental Health

Many struggle with time management, stress, and feelings of isolation or anxiety. The transition from high school to college can be particularly difficult, as students adjust to a new environment, a more demanding academic workload, and greater independence.

Reflections from College Graduates: Career Paths and Practical Applications

College graduates offer valuable insights into the long-term benefits and drawbacks of their educational investment. While some graduates find that their college degree directly translates into career success and financial stability, others face challenges in the job market or discover that their skills and interests lie in a different field.

It is important to recognize that the value of a college degree extends beyond immediate employment prospects. Many graduates report that their college education equipped them with valuable critical thinking, communication, and problem-solving skills that are applicable to a wide range of careers and life situations.

Diverse Career Paths and Evolving Skillsets

The career paths of college graduates are increasingly diverse, reflecting the changing nature of the workforce and the growing demand for interdisciplinary skills. Graduates are finding opportunities in fields that did not even exist a decade ago, highlighting the importance of adaptability, creativity, and lifelong learning.

Employer Expectations: Skills and Qualifications in the Workplace

Employers play a crucial role in shaping the value of a college degree by determining the skills and qualifications they seek in job candidates. While a college degree remains a significant credential for many employers, they are increasingly focused on practical skills, relevant experience, and demonstrated ability to solve real-world problems.

Employers often emphasize the importance of soft skills such as communication, teamwork, and leadership, as well as technical skills specific to their industry. Internships, volunteer work, and other extracurricular activities can provide students with valuable opportunities to develop these skills and enhance their employability.

Bridging the Skills Gap

The perceived "skills gap" between what is taught in educational institutions and what is demanded by employers remains a significant concern. Colleges and universities are increasingly working to bridge this gap by incorporating more practical training, experiential learning opportunities, and industry partnerships into their curriculum.

The Role of High School Counselors: Guiding Students Toward the Future

High school counselors serve as invaluable resources for students navigating the complex world of college admissions and career planning. They provide guidance on academic planning, standardized testing, college selection, financial aid, and career exploration.

Counselors work to ensure that all students, regardless of their background or circumstances, have access to the information and support they need to make informed decisions about their future. However, many counselors are overburdened with large caseloads, limiting their ability to provide individualized attention to each student.

College Professors and Instructors: Shaping Minds and Preparing for the Workforce

College professors and instructors are at the forefront of delivering higher education, shaping the minds of future leaders, and preparing students for the workforce. They are responsible for designing and delivering engaging curriculum, fostering critical thinking skills, and providing mentorship and guidance to their students.

Their dedication shapes the future workforce.

Beyond the Classroom: Mentorship and Guidance

Beyond their teaching responsibilities, professors often serve as mentors and role models, providing students with career advice, research opportunities, and networking connections. Their expertise and guidance can have a profound impact on students’ academic and professional trajectories.

Financial Aid Officers: Navigating the Complexities of College Financing

Financial aid officers play a crucial role in making college accessible and affordable for students from all socioeconomic backgrounds. They help students and families navigate the complex world of financial aid, including loans, grants, scholarships, and work-study programs.

Demystifying the process is key.

Understanding Loans, Grants, and Scholarships

Financial aid officers provide guidance on completing the Free Application for Federal Student Aid (FAFSA), understanding student loan options, and exploring scholarship opportunities. They work to ensure that students have the resources they need to finance their education and minimize their debt burden.

Alternative Paths: Individuals Without a College Degree

While a college degree is often seen as the traditional pathway to success, it is important to recognize that many individuals achieve fulfilling careers and lives without one. Entrepreneurs, skilled tradespeople, artists, and self-taught experts demonstrate that alternative paths can lead to success and fulfillment.

Challenging the Traditional Narrative

Exploring the experiences of individuals without a college degree challenges the traditional narrative that a four-year degree is the only route to success. It highlights the importance of individual skills, talents, and determination, as well as the value of alternative forms of education and training.

Success Stories: Graduates and Non-Graduates Alike

Examining real-world success stories provides a balanced perspective on the value of higher education. Success stories featuring college graduates highlight the opportunities and advantages that a college degree can provide. At the same time, success stories featuring individuals without a college degree demonstrate that talent, hard work, and determination can overcome educational barriers.

Lessons from Bill Gates and Steve Jobs

The stories of Bill Gates and Steve Jobs, both college dropouts who went on to become visionary entrepreneurs, illustrate the power of innovation, risk-taking, and a relentless pursuit of one’s passion. While their paths are exceptional, they serve as a reminder that success can be achieved through unconventional means.

The Higher Education Landscape: Navigating Diverse Options

[Diverse Perspectives on Higher Education: A Human-Centered Approach
The discourse surrounding higher education often revolves around statistics, economic projections, and institutional rankings. However, to truly understand the value—and the challenges—of pursuing a college degree, we must turn our attention to the diverse individuals whose lives are shaped by it. Building on that approach, it is crucial to explore the multifaceted landscape of higher education, encompassing a range of institutions and platforms. This allows prospective students and their families to grasp the available options and make informed decisions.]

High Schools: The Foundation of Future Aspirations

High schools serve as the initial launchpad for college aspirations, laying the groundwork for students’ future academic pursuits.

They provide the foundational knowledge and skills necessary for higher education.

However, their effectiveness in preparing students for college varies considerably.

Curriculum rigor, access to advanced placement courses, and the quality of college counseling all play significant roles.

Ultimately, high schools are a critical factor in shaping student aspirations.

Colleges & Universities: A Spectrum of Choices

The landscape of colleges and universities is incredibly diverse.

It ranges from large, public research institutions to small, private liberal arts colleges.

Public universities, often state-funded, typically offer a wider range of programs and cater to larger student populations.

Private universities, on the other hand, often boast smaller class sizes and a more focused academic environment.

The "best" college is highly subjective and depends on individual needs and goals.

Factors to consider include academic reputation, campus culture, location, and cost.

The sheer number of options can be overwhelming.

Careful research and campus visits are crucial for finding the right fit.

Trade & Vocational Schools: Skills for a Changing Economy

Trade and vocational schools offer a compelling alternative to traditional four-year colleges.

These institutions provide specialized training in specific skills and trades, such as carpentry, welding, and culinary arts.

In an era where skilled trades are increasingly in demand, vocational training can lead to immediate employment and a fulfilling career.

Trade schools often have shorter program lengths and lower tuition costs than traditional colleges, making them an attractive option for students seeking a more direct path to employment.

However, it’s crucial to research the job placement rates and industry reputation of any trade school under consideration.

Online Learning Platforms: Democratizing Education

Online learning platforms have revolutionized access to education.

MOOCs (Massive Open Online Courses), online degree programs, and certification courses offer flexible and affordable learning opportunities for students of all ages and backgrounds.

Online learning can be a particularly attractive option for individuals who are working full-time, have family responsibilities, or live in remote areas.

The quality of online programs can vary significantly.

Accreditation and instructor credentials are important considerations.

Furthermore, self-discipline and strong time management skills are essential for success in an online learning environment.

Workplaces: Testing the Value of Education

Ultimately, the value of a college education is tested in the workplace.

Employers seek candidates with a combination of technical skills, critical thinking abilities, and communication skills.

While a college degree can provide a foundation for these skills, it is not a guarantee of success.

Internships, project-based learning, and real-world experiences are increasingly important for demonstrating competence and securing employment.

The evolving job market demands adaptability and a commitment to lifelong learning.

The ability to continuously acquire new skills is crucial for navigating the complexities of the modern workplace.

Deconstructing the Value of College: Key Concepts and Considerations

The discourse surrounding higher education often revolves around statistics, economic projections, and institutional rankings. However, to truly understand the value—and the challenges—of pursuing a college degree, we must delve into the fundamental concepts that underpin this complex landscape.

This section aims to dissect those core ideas, providing a framework for analyzing the benefits and drawbacks of higher education in the 21st century.

Defining Higher Education

At its core, higher education encompasses any formal learning pursued after secondary school. This includes undergraduate and graduate programs at universities, community colleges, technical schools, and professional certifications. The purpose extends beyond mere job training.

It’s about fostering intellectual growth, critical thinking, and the development of well-rounded individuals capable of contributing meaningfully to society.

The Elusive Return on Investment (ROI)

The Return on Investment (ROI) of a college education is a complex calculation. It attempts to quantify the financial benefits relative to the costs. The calculation includes tuition, fees, books, and living expenses.

It also factors in lost earnings during the college years.

The potential benefits encompass higher lifetime earnings, improved job security, and greater opportunities for career advancement.

However, a simplistic ROI calculation often fails to capture the full picture. Intangible benefits like personal growth and expanded networks are harder to quantify but equally valuable.

The Weight of Student Debt

Student debt represents a significant challenge for many graduates. The burden of repaying loans can impact financial decisions for years, influencing everything from homeownership to career choices.

It’s crucial to understand the terms of your loans, including interest rates and repayment options. Explore income-driven repayment plans and loan forgiveness programs, if applicable.

Careful budgeting and financial planning can help mitigate the long-term impact of student debt.

Career Opportunities: Bridging Education and Employment

The connection between college majors, skills acquired, and job prospects is a critical consideration. While a specific degree doesn’t guarantee a specific job, it does open doors to certain industries and roles.

Research high-growth fields and emerging industries to align your education with future job market demands. Consider internships and experiential learning opportunities to gain practical skills and industry knowledge.

Addressing the Skills Gap

The skills gap refers to the mismatch between the skills taught in educational institutions and the skills demanded by employers. This gap often leaves graduates feeling unprepared for the workforce, while employers struggle to find qualified candidates.

Closing this gap requires collaboration between educators and industry leaders to ensure curricula are relevant and up-to-date.

Emphasizing critical thinking, problem-solving, and communication skills can help graduates adapt to evolving job requirements.

The Enduring Value of a Liberal Arts Education

A liberal arts education emphasizes broad-based knowledge, critical thinking, and effective communication. While often criticized for lacking specific job training, a liberal arts degree can provide a strong foundation for a variety of careers.

It cultivates adaptability, problem-solving skills, and the ability to learn new concepts quickly. These skills are increasingly valuable in a rapidly changing job market.

STEM Fields: Investing in the Future

STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering, and Mathematics) fields are often touted for their high earning potential and strong job prospects. These fields drive innovation and economic growth, creating a demand for skilled professionals.

However, pursuing a STEM degree requires a strong aptitude for math and science. It also demands a commitment to lifelong learning, as these fields are constantly evolving.

Critical Thinking: The Cornerstone of Intellectual Development

Critical thinking is a fundamental skill fostered by higher education. It involves analyzing information objectively, evaluating arguments, and forming reasoned judgments.

College courses often challenge students to think critically about complex issues. Developing these skills prepares graduates to solve problems creatively and make informed decisions in their personal and professional lives.

The Power of Networking

Networking is an essential aspect of career advancement. College provides opportunities to connect with professors, classmates, alumni, and industry professionals. Building strong relationships can lead to internships, job opportunities, and valuable mentorship.

Attend industry events, join professional organizations, and actively engage with your network to expand your connections.

Personal Development: Beyond the Textbook

Personal development is an often-overlooked benefit of college. The college years are a time of significant growth, maturation, and self-discovery.

Living away from home, navigating social dynamics, and challenging oneself academically can foster independence, resilience, and a stronger sense of self.

The Gateway to Experience: Internships

Internships provide invaluable practical experience and career insights. They allow students to apply their knowledge in a real-world setting, develop professional skills, and explore different career paths.

Actively seek out internship opportunities in your field of interest. A successful internship can significantly enhance your resume and increase your chances of landing a job after graduation.

Major Selection: Charting Your Academic Course

Major selection is a crucial decision that should be based on your interests, skills, and career goals. Research different majors and career paths to determine which aligns best with your strengths and aspirations.

Don’t be afraid to explore different options and change your major if necessary.

It’s better to switch early than to pursue a degree you’re not passionate about.

Alternative Career Paths: Beyond the Traditional

Alternative career paths, such as entrepreneurship and vocational training, offer viable routes to success outside traditional college routes.

Entrepreneurship requires creativity, drive, and a willingness to take risks. Vocational training provides specific skills for high-demand trades, such as plumbing, electrical work, and automotive repair.

Promoting Equity and Access

Equity and access to higher education remain critical issues. Disparities in opportunities based on socioeconomic status, race, and other factors persist.

Addressing these disparities requires systemic changes, including increased financial aid, targeted support programs, and efforts to create more inclusive campus environments.

The "College Wage Premium" Explained

The "college wage premium" refers to the earnings gap between college graduates and those with only a high school diploma. While this premium has fluctuated over time, college graduates generally earn significantly more over their lifetimes.

However, the wage premium varies depending on the major, the institution attended, and the individual’s career path.

The Rising Tide of Tuition Inflation

Inflation in college tuition is a major concern. The rising costs of higher education make it increasingly difficult for students to afford a degree.

Controlling tuition costs requires innovative solutions, such as increased government funding, improved efficiency in college operations, and alternative learning models.

The Intangible Value of a Degree

The value of a degree extends beyond monetary benefits. A college education can foster personal growth, intellectual development, and civic engagement.

It can broaden your perspectives, enhance your critical thinking skills, and prepare you to be a more informed and engaged citizen.

These intangible benefits contribute to a more fulfilling and meaningful life.

Institutional Actors: The Organizations Shaping Higher Education

The discourse surrounding higher education often revolves around statistics, economic projections, and institutional rankings. However, to truly understand the value—and the challenges—of pursuing a college degree, we must delve into the fundamental concepts that underpin this complex ecosystem. Central to this understanding is recognizing the key institutional actors that influence policy, funding, and access within higher education.

The U.S. Department of Education: Steering the Ship

The U.S. Department of Education stands as the primary federal agency responsible for shaping education policy and administering federal funding programs. Its influence extends across all levels of education, but its impact on higher education is particularly profound.

The Department sets national priorities, allocates billions of dollars in financial aid, and enforces regulations related to accreditation and student rights. Its decisions directly affect college affordability, access, and the quality of education received by millions of students.

However, the Department’s role is not without its critics. Some argue that federal overreach can stifle innovation and impose burdensome regulations on institutions. The ongoing debate over student loan forgiveness and the Department’s handling of for-profit colleges underscore the complexities and controversies surrounding its mandate.

Standardized Testing Titans: College Board and ACT, Inc.

The College Board and ACT, Inc. wield considerable influence as the creators and administrators of standardized tests like the SAT and ACT. These tests have long served as gatekeepers to higher education, influencing college admissions decisions and shaping students’ academic trajectories.

College Board: Beyond the SAT

While best known for the SAT, the College Board also provides a range of college preparation resources, including the PSAT, AP courses, and online tools like BigFuture. Its reach extends beyond testing, aiming to support students throughout their college journey.

The College Board’s commitment to accessibility, exemplified through fee waivers and initiatives to reduce bias in testing, has been commendable. Yet, concerns persist about the predictive validity of the SAT and its potential to perpetuate socioeconomic disparities.

ACT, Inc.: An Alternative Assessment

ACT, Inc. offers an alternative standardized assessment that is widely accepted by colleges and universities. The ACT differs from the SAT in its content and format, emphasizing curriculum-based assessment.

Like the College Board, ACT, Inc. provides resources to help students prepare for college and navigate the admissions process. The increasing adoption of test-optional policies by colleges has challenged the dominance of standardized testing, prompting both organizations to adapt and evolve.

Universities and Colleges: A Diverse Landscape

The landscape of higher education institutions is incredibly diverse, ranging from large public universities to small private colleges, community colleges, and specialized vocational schools. Each type of institution offers unique strengths and caters to different student populations.

Public vs. Private Institutions

Public universities, supported by state funding, generally offer lower tuition rates and a broader range of academic programs. They often play a vital role in serving local communities and driving economic development.

Private colleges, while typically more expensive, may offer smaller class sizes, a more personalized learning experience, and a strong focus on specific disciplines or values.

Community Colleges: An Accessible Pathway

Community colleges provide an accessible entry point to higher education, offering affordable tuition and a range of associate degrees and certificate programs. They serve as critical stepping stones for students seeking to transfer to four-year institutions or enter the workforce directly.

The diversity of universities and colleges underscores the importance of careful research and thoughtful decision-making in choosing the right educational path.

Financial Aid Providers: Bridging the Affordability Gap

Financing a college education can be a daunting challenge for many students and families. A multitude of institutions play a critical role in assisting students in financing their education.

Government agencies like the U.S. Department of Education administer federal student loan programs, grants (such as Pell Grants), and work-study opportunities. Private lenders offer alternative loan options, while non-profit organizations provide scholarships and financial counseling.

Navigating the complex world of financial aid requires careful planning, research, and a thorough understanding of available resources. Addressing the rising cost of college and ensuring equitable access to financial assistance remains a paramount concern for policymakers and educational leaders alike.

Resources and Methods: Tools for Evaluating College Options

The discourse surrounding higher education often revolves around statistics, economic projections, and institutional rankings. However, to truly understand the value—and the challenges—of pursuing a college degree, we must delve into the fundamental concepts that underpin this complex system, and leverage the tools available to make informed decisions. This involves understanding the resources designed to aid prospective students and their families in navigating the intricate process of college selection and financing.

The FAFSA: Unlocking Federal Financial Aid

The Free Application for Federal Student Aid (FAFSA) is the cornerstone of financial aid accessibility in the United States.

It serves as the primary gateway to federal grants, loans, and work-study programs.

Completing the FAFSA is a critical first step for any student seeking financial assistance to pursue higher education.

The information provided on the FAFSA determines a student’s eligibility for various aid programs.

These programs can significantly reduce the overall cost of college.

It is imperative that students and families understand the FAFSA process and complete it accurately and on time.

Meeting deadlines is crucial to maximize the potential for receiving aid.

College Scorecard: Data-Driven Insights

The College Scorecard, developed by the U.S. Department of Education, is a powerful tool for evaluating college options based on objective data.

It provides transparent information on college costs, graduation rates, student debt levels, and post-graduation earnings.

Prospective students can use the College Scorecard to compare institutions side-by-side.

This data-driven approach helps families assess the potential return on investment (ROI) of different college choices.

The Scorecard also offers insights into the demographics of student bodies.

This helps gauge the diversity and inclusivity of various institutions.

By analyzing this wealth of information, students can make more informed decisions.

They can align their academic pursuits with their financial capabilities and career aspirations.

Salary Calculators: Projecting Future Earnings

Estimating potential earnings based on education and career choices is a vital component of college planning.

Salary calculators, often provided by professional organizations, government agencies, and online resources, can assist in this process.

These tools allow users to input factors such as degree type, major, and geographic location.

They then provide projections of potential future income.

While salary calculators offer estimates and should not be taken as guarantees, they can provide a valuable framework for understanding the potential financial benefits of different career paths.

This is especially helpful when considering majors in high-demand fields versus those with potentially lower earning potential.

Careful research using these tools can illuminate the financial implications of various educational paths.

Online Courses and Platforms: Expanding Educational Horizons

The rise of online learning platforms has democratized access to education.

Platforms like Coursera, edX, and Khan Academy offer a wide range of courses, often at low cost or even for free.

These resources can supplement traditional classroom learning, allowing students to explore subjects of interest, develop new skills, and even earn certifications that enhance their resumes.

Online courses can also serve as a "test drive" for potential college majors, helping students determine if a particular field aligns with their interests and abilities.

The flexibility and accessibility of online learning make it a valuable tool for lifelong learning and career advancement.

It also allows students to continue their education while managing other responsibilities.

Student Loan Repayment Calculators: Planning for the Future

For many students, student loans are a necessary reality of financing a college education.

Understanding repayment options and planning for post-graduation financial obligations is crucial.

Student loan repayment calculators, available from various lenders and financial aid websites, can help students estimate their monthly payments, explore different repayment plans, and assess the long-term costs of borrowing.

These calculators allow users to input their loan amounts, interest rates, and income levels to project repayment schedules and total interest paid over the life of the loan.

By utilizing these tools, students can make informed decisions about borrowing and develop a sustainable repayment strategy that fits their individual financial circumstances.

Budgeting Tools: Managing College Expenses

Effective budgeting is essential for managing the costs associated with attending college.

Various online tools and apps can help students track their expenses, create budgets, and identify areas where they can save money.

These tools allow students to monitor their spending on tuition, fees, books, housing, food, and other living expenses.

By developing sound financial habits early on, students can minimize debt and maximize their financial well-being throughout their college years and beyond.

This skillset serves as a foundation for responsible financial management later in life.

So, is attending college after high school the right move for you? Ultimately, it’s a deeply personal decision. Weigh the pros and cons, consider your passions, and think about where you see yourself in five or ten years. No matter what path you choose, remember to be intentional and pursue it with everything you’ve got!